Dan Brown's new book. Just finished it.
A compelling page turner. And again he has done a lot of research as he is more than just a novelist imo.
But it left me wondering where Dan Brown wants to take the reader?
Maybe because I am not quite prepared to go there.

Anyone else read the book?

John,

I haven't read it yet, but your post makes me really curious. Are you saying you'd like feedback from someone with a background in esoteric or metaphysical stuff and/or the history of religion? I don't actually know everything even though I pretend I do, but I'd say I have a pretty decent background. Besides, what you've posted sounds intriquing. I guess I could read some Amazon reviews if nothing else.

--Linda

quote:

I haven't read it yet, but your post makes me really curious. Are you saying you'd like feedback from someone with a background in esoteric or metaphysical stuff and/or the history of religion?

Exactly!

Especially Brown's adsorption with the Freemasons.

Not much in terms of reviews on Amazon so far.

"adsorption"?
--
Stephen

quote:

Originally posted by JohnT:

quote:

I haven't read it yet, but your post makes me really curious. Are you saying you'd like feedback from someone with a background in esoteric or metaphysical stuff and/or the history of religion?

Exactly!

Especially Brown's adsorption with the Freemasons.

Not much in terms of reviews on Amazon so far.

John,
,
Well, I tried to read a sample page on Amazon but there was something wrong with the server. I don't know too much about the Masons, but if you want some good background with an esoteric slant, you should probably read The Hiram Key. It's by two Masons whose names I have forgotten, and I no longer have the book. It mostly focuses on Rosslyn Chapel in Scotland, which was restored a number of years ago and is now a major tourist attraction. Prince Charles is a Mason and paid a visit to Rosslyn Chapel a few years ago. Maybe he's been back since then, but I haven't checked out their website for a while. I'll do it now so I can post the link here.

The layout of the chapel is based upon the Second Temple in Jerusalem, but the carved decoration on the walls is said to be "pagan," which wouldn't bother me one little bit! However, I understand that in the past some priests and ministers have refused to perform Christian ceremonies there, saying it wasn't a "Christian" place. They are right about THAT!

Rosslyn Chapel is owned and/or maintained by the Sinclair family, whose name was originally St. Clair. They are the descendants of the original builder. That's all I can come up with off the top of my head.

Rosslyn Chapel official website

Everyone: Please do yourselves a big favor and check out the photographs on this site. The stone carving and stained glass are stunning! They have done a wonderful job of restoration so far, and it's still going on.

--Linda

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen:
"adsorption"?
--
Stephen

Thank you for pointing out my typo.
It really contributed to the discussion.

quote:

Thank you for pointing out my typo.
It really contributed to the discussion.

Sorry for any offense. I was just trying to understand what you meant, since it is a real word.
--
Stephen

Bluelamp,

I read some of the channeling at your link:

quote:

Q: (L) I would like to know what is the origin of the Freemasons?
A: Osirians.
Q: (L) Can you tell us when the original Freemasons formed as a society?
A: 5633 B.C.
Q: (L) Is Freemasonry as it is practiced today the same?
A: 33rd degree, yes.
Q: (L) So, there is a continuing tradition for over 7 thousand years?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Is this organization with a plan to take over and rule the world?
A: Not exactly.
Q: (L) What is their focus?
A: Overseers of the status of Quorum.
Q: (L) What is the Quorum?
A: Deeper knowledge organization. Totally secret to your kind as of yet. Very important with regard to your future.

This is consistent with the research set for in The Hiram Key which I mentioned earlier. The authors build a convincing case for an ancient Egyptian origin for the Masons, unchanged at its highest (or deepest?) levels since ancient times. One particular password has been transmitted unchanged also.

The Hiram Key - Amazon link

An excellent review of The Hiram Key.


--Linda

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen:

quote:

Thank you for pointing out my typo.
It really contributed to the discussion.

Sorry for any offense. I was just trying to understand what you meant, since it is a real word.
--
Stephen

Sorry for my reaction.

quote:

John,
,
Well, I tried to read a sample page on Amazon but there was something wrong with the server. I don't know too much about the Masons, but if you want some good background with an esoteric slant, you should probably read The Hiram Key. It's by two Masons whose names I have forgotten, and I no longer have the book. It mostly focuses on Rosslyn Chapel in Scotland, which was restored a number of years ago and is now a major tourist attraction. Prince Charles is a Mason and paid a visit to Rosslyn Chapel a few years ago. Maybe he's been back since then, but I haven't checked out their website for a while. I'll do it now so I can post the link here.

Linda,

I am assuming that the Rosslyn Chapel is the same one featured in Dan Brown's "The DaVinci Code".

I am as interested in Brown's intense interest in the Freemason's as anything else.

I am going to printout bluelamp's link and read it in easy chair comfort.

Tonight. Discovery channel. 11 PM EST. Two hour documentary.

" Hunting the Lost Symbol"

Must see! Hope it is repeated again.

quote:

Originally posted by JohnT:
Dan Brown's new book. Just finished it.
A compelling page turner. And again he has done a lot of research as he is more than just a novelist imo.
But it left me wondering where Dan Brown wants to take the reader?
Maybe because I am not quite prepared to go there.

Anyone else read the book?

I finished it today. It was an incredible page-turner. The villain Ma'lak was second to none. I appreciate the many messages of the author and the ending was quite valid. Where were you not prepared to go, JohnT?

Holy Bhagworm

This book sounds like it ties in very nicely with Jeff Sharlet's The Family, which is NOT a fictional work.

Very disturbing stuff.

quote:

Where were you not prepared to go, JohnT?

The very end and its references to the Bible, and other holy books.
I'm just not sure what he is trying to tell us.
Maybe it's just me.

quote:

Originally posted by winkin noddin:
This book sounds like it ties in very nicely with Jeff Sharlet's The Family, which is NOT a fictional work.

Very disturbing stuff.

Wink, HB and everyone,

I haven't read The Lost Symbol and still don't have a clear idea what it's about, but I'll take your word for it that it ties in with Jeff Sharlet's The Family, which I have known about for several years. I haven't read his new book, but I did read the account of his going undercover as a recruit for "The Family" to get the inside story. What he found out disturbed him deeply--and it disturbed a lot of other people after they read his account. I believe it was published in the The New Yorker but I really can't remember offhand. That experience and that article became the basis for the book he just published.

If the connection you're seeing is a valid one, then it ties in with all the current "hot" topics on this board, including the speculations between Bluelamp and me on the "Why do Christians Hate Jews?" topic. If the connection is valid, then we are dealing with something very evil, very powerful and until recently very secret. It isn't as powerful as it once was now that it's on the verge of being exposed.

From what everyone has said, and from my memory of The Da Vinci Code which I read in 2003, I have a strong feeling Dan Brown is a Mason and writes from a position of inside knowledge.

--Linda

From Bluelamp's link:

quote:

Yes, over and over again this or that person claimed to have "discovered" the "Greatest Secret," to have "found the evidence" that there was some group that had long term plans to take over the World, but in the end, the evidence would not hold up to scrutiny, or would slip away like mercury. The trail would come up against a locked door. I finally understood that this was the "nature of the beast." It was deliberate. These Secret Masters manipulate our lives and experiences like puppet masters. And, I understood something else: they also leave clues here and there to lead potential members through a complex maze for purposes of possible recruitment. And many of these clues are so convincing, are so "synchronous," are so cunningly set up that it is easy to come to the wrong conclusions - to believe that you have arrived at the "Holy City," when, in fact, you have only come across a road sign pointing the wrong way.

I have to take issue with this because she's really gone off the deep end here. She has started to see evil as MORE powerful than good, and that's really dangerous--not to mention totally demoralizing. I refuse to believe that synchronistic events can be manipulated since they are a manifestation of the inherent intelligence and goodness of the Universe. To believe otherwise would mean the bad guys have ALREADY won! It would be the most demonic and extreme form of dualism imaginable. Hell, even the Manichaeans believed that good would eventually triumph out over evil!

If I thought Laura would take me up on any book recommendations, I'd suggest she re-read The Lord of the Rings if she hasn't done it in the last few years. That would help her get her priorites straight and keep them straight.

The Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis wouldn't be a bad choice either. I realize it's kindergarten stuff, but sometimes that's just what you need. Also, C.S. Lewis was a close friend of J.R.R. Tolkien's. Both of them had their hearts and heads in the right place, despite Tolkien being a Catholic and Lewis being a Protestant...and me being neither! On the deeper level I can still recognize and appreciate where they were coming from.

--Linda

Linda, of course synchronicity is important (see below) but since bad aliens time travel, it is no problem at all for them to set up false synchronicities if they so desire (see even farther below).

Q: (L) I would like to ask a little bit about synchronicity. I would like to know what is the source of synchronous events. Is it a multiple source or is it something that comes out of the percipient's own mind or... (J) is it random?
A: Imagine a young school child walking along the street, standing beside a rose bush, picking one of the flowers, and asking the flower: "Would you please explain Einstein's theory of relativity to me today."... "What is
synchronicity" is incredibly complex. It involves aspects in every imaginable state of reality merging together in what could best be described, if seen visually, as a massive mosaic in perfect balance. But, that is not adequate to a response for your question...
(J) Ummm it's adequate enough.
Q: (T) Several sessions back when we were discussing "Perpendicular Realities" you were talking about something that happened to me and that I had to look back over my life and analyze my relationships with other people from a certain
point up until now and you said that this was a perpendicular reality. What is the definition of a perpendicular reality?
A: The perpendicular reality primarily, though not exclusively, refers to one's life path and how one's life path fits together in the cycle or in a wheel when connected with those of a similar life path. And, oddly enough, relates very closely to the previous question involving synchronicity... [(J) Yeah...] If you can picture an inlaid wheel formed by a circle within a circle, and adjoining partitions in a perfect balance...
Q: (L) Are we, by connecting into this wheel, so to speak, activating the wave in some way?
A: We are not clear about your interesting interpretation there, but it is true that you have an interactive relationship with the wave... And, of course, it does involve your progress through the grand cycle. And the perpendicular reality, again is, of course, an advancement from the core outward which is yet another reflection of all reality and all that exists... Now, we wish to return to the visual representation as mentioned previously. If you notice the core circle connects with all seven sections to the outer circle. Now, picture that outer circle as being an ever expanding circle, and each one of the seven segments as being an ever expanding line. Of course, now, this will expand outward in a circular or cyclical pattern. Please picture visually an expanding outer circle and a non-expanding inner circle.
Q: (Laura and S***) It keeps on going.
A: It does?
Q: (L) Um hmmm!
A: Where does it go to?
Q: (SV) Forever. (J) Back to itself. (L) We don't know that.
A: Oh, someone said "Back to itself."
Q: (J) Like a snake taking hold of its own tail... It comes all the way back to itself.
A: Right...


"At this point, I would like to insert a little remark made by the Cassiopaeans in response to a question about a bizarre synchronicity that seemed a definite confirmation of an idea, a minor idea, it should be said.

11-19-94

Q: (L) Is the information about the electronic ignition systems correct?

A: Disinformation comes from seemingly reliable sources. It is extremely important for you to not gather false knowledge as it is more damaging than no knowledge at all. Remember knowledge protects, ignorance endangers. The information you speak of, T___, was given to you deliberately because you and J__ and others have been targeted due to your intense interest in level of density 4 through 7 subject matter. You have already been documented as a "threat." Remember, disinformation is very effective when delivered by highly trained sources because hypnotic and transdimensional techniques are used thereby causing electronic anomalies to follow suggestion causing perceived confirmation to occur.

Q: (T) But I'm just a nobody. Why would they go to all trouble ...

A: Several answers follow: Number One, Nobody is a "nobody." Number two, it is no trouble at all for aforementioned forces to give seemingly individualized attention to anybody. Number three, T___ has been targeted and so has J___ and others because you are on the right track.

Now, the implications of the above, in regard to Rennes-le-Chateau, are enormous. IF any part of it is correct, it means that the "synchronicities" and strange events that seem to confirm this or that idea can, and very well MAY BE, designed to lead the researcher in the WRONG direction!"

-- John

Another quote from Bluelamp's link (with commentary):

quote:

1. Why, after spending purportedly 5.5 million dollars to isolate and attempt to patent Monoatomic Gold, has David Hudson's obsession for knowledge suddenly stopped short of self-experimentation? (I know, he says his wife won't let him, but that begs the question with something like he claims to have discovered , especially if he is as convinced of what it is as he claims to be and is trying to "sell the public" on it.)

2. If David Hudson possesses the "Philosopher's Stone" why is he asking for money? The literature tells us that one part in one hundred thousand will transmute base metals into gold. Doesn't it work?

3. If The Secret Masters have existed these many thousands of years with the knowledge and use of this substance, and if they have kept it a continual secret, assassinating, if necessary, entire groups of people to protect the secret, why is it suddenly being allowed out now?

Art Kunkin, my cousin the alchemist, says that the Philosopher's Stone is plain old pitchblende! And he does experiment on himself and he's been doing it for a while now. He takes a piece of fruit like an apple or pear and puts it on some pitchblende rocks, and lets it sit there for a day or so to absorb some of the radiation...and then he eats it. This isn't really as weird as it might sound, because the key to it is low-level radiation. It would be very easy to OD as you can imagine.

I'm not sure how long Art has been doing this experiment, but I believe it's been for about two years now. So far it doesn't appear to have hurt him. He says his hair has been growing in thicker than ever, even though he's 81 years old now.

I posted the link to his Gaia profile because his old website has been suspended for some unknown reason. Art is no crank, but a serious practicing alchemist with many years of experience. He was the founder and editor of the Los Angeles Free Press back in the Sixties, which is when I first met him. According to my aunt I'm supposed to be related to him, but I have yet to untangle the relationship.

--Linda

quote:

Originally posted by JohnT:

quote:

Where were you not prepared to go, JohnT?

The very end and its references to the Bible, and other holy books.
I'm just not sure what he is trying to tell us.
Maybe it's just me.

I'm sorry, John, but I think it's you. The book is incredible. BUT...if you can do better...please start writing and send me an advance copy. Please!

I think the ending was disappointing to you because...because it's like the song, "Is that all that there is?" But the message is exactly what the truth is...and that the political bullsh*t which has tried so desperately to destroy and control the message is all what it's all about.

Holy Bhagworm

quote:

I'm sorry, John, but I think it's you. The book is incredible. BUT...if you can do better...please start writing and send me an advance copy. Please!

Don't be so quick to assume that I was putting down the book!
It was great. Dan Brown is maybe, the most thought provoking author of our time.
And I recommend it to everyone.
He just lost me with the holy books at the very end. If that makes me a mental midget in your estimation, so be it.

quote:

Originally posted by JohnT:

quote:

I'm sorry, John, but I think it's you. The book is incredible. BUT...if you can do better...please start writing and send me an advance copy. Please!

Don't be so quick to assume that I was putting down the book!
It was great. Dan Brown is maybe, the most thought provoking author of our time.
And I recommend it to everyone.
He just lost me with the holy books at the very end. If that makes me a mental midget in your estimation, so be it.

John and HB,

Okay, you guys have accomplished at least one constructive thing with your bickering--you've made me desperately curious to read The Lost Symbol! I want to know what all this stuff about the holy books is about, and I want to know it RIGHT NOW!!! It happens that I have a pretty solid background in this area because of my long involvement in the Gnostic Society, and my interest in the Nag Hammadi Library and other Gnostic documents. I want to know what Dan Brown has to say about them or any similar ancient texts.

The book of Enoch, for example...I understand that for centuries the Masons had the only copy of it--except for the one stashed away in the Vatican basement? Until the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1948(?), the one the Masons had was the only known copy of it. It's assumed that it was found by the original nine Templars when they were excavating at the site of the Temple in Jerusalem.

What else they found is still unknown--maybe some actual writings of Jesus? It's believed that Jesus only taught orally and never wrote anything down, and that could very well be true. But if he did write any books, it's for damn sure the Church would have hidden or destroyed every copy they could find.

--Linda

quote:

Okay, you guys have accomplished at least one constructive thing with your bickering--you've made me desperately curious to read The Lost Symbol! I want to know what all this stuff about the holy books is about, and I want to know it RIGHT NOW!!! It happens that I have a pretty solid background in this area because of my long involvement in the Gnostic Society, and my interest in the Nag Hammadi Library and other Gnostic documents. I want to know what Dan Brown has to say about them or any similar ancient texts

Hi Linda!
One way of motivating you to read the book.

I've tried to follow some of your somewhat esoteric posts on these matters without much success. Have read "Holy Blood Holy Grail" in bits and pieces if that means anything. But you are light years beyond me.

I do get the impression that Dan Brown's perspectives and yours may not be quite the same.

Linda, here's a website that mentions and has downloads for a couple of the "holy books".

http://www.thelostsymbol-noeti...he-ancient-mysteries

"Specifically mentioned in Dan Brown’s book are the ancient writings The Kybalion, The Upanishads, The Complete Zohar, The Secret Teachings of All Ages, and last, but not least, The Bible."

The Institute of Noetic Science is mentioned and that's kind of a UFO related place:

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cass...ea/adventures182.htm

"Ark was certainly intrigued at such a discussion and did some websearches on the participants. I was pretty intrigued to see that there were a number of members of the so-called Aviary onboard, including Ron Pandolfi, John Alexander, Bruce Macabbee and Hal Puthoff. Also on the Sarfatti discussion list were Joe Firmage, Uri Geller (Involved with Puthoff, Targ and Ingo Swan in SRI research), Stan Krippner, Russel Targ(SRI remote viewing with Puthoff and Swan), Ed Mitchell (Astronaut and Founder of The Institute of Noetic Science), Eric Davis and, of course, Blue.

The reader may also be interested in doing a little research on their own to discover that there are other "links" between some of these individuals and other organizations. For example, John Alexander and Jacques Vallee work for Billionaire Robert Bigelow who created an organization called the National Institute of Discovery Science or NIDS for short.

Segue to the present: Additional research by our research team reveals to us that there is a curious New Age/Science cross-over organization called the Axiom Visiting Faculty.


Here we find the following:

Drunvalo Melchizedek,
Mitchell (NIDS,Sarfatti),
Castaneda followers,
Deepak Chopra,
Fred Alan Wolfe,
Greg Braden,
Joe Firmage (Sarfatti/ He's also on the Institute of Noetic Sciences board),
John Mack (Rockefeller sponsored NDE and Alien abduction hypnosis researcher),
Laurie Monroe (Monroe Institute),
Rabbi Michael Lerner
Peter Russel (Institute of Noetic Science/Mitchell's(NIDS) private organization),
Russel Targ (Remote Viewing pioneer along with Puthoff and Ingo Swan at SRI in the 70's and 80s),
Steven Greer(Rockefeller funded UFO researcher),
Zecharia Sitchin."

quote:

I've tried to follow some of your somewhat esoteric posts on these matters without much success. Have read "Holy Blood Holy Grail" in bits and pieces if that means anything. But you are light years beyond me.

John,

I haven't read "Holy Blood, Holy Grail," although I don't know why not when everyone has been talking about it for years. I have read a book with a similar thesis called "The Bloodline of the Holy Grail." As a matter of fact I originally photocopied and enlarged the black and white version of the engraving of Sophia on my wall out of that book. Later Sean sent me the colored version, and that's what I'm using now as my Facebook avatar.

I usually call her by her Greek name because that's what she was called by the Gnostics, and it was through the Gnostic writings and my involvement in the Gnostic Society that I first came to know her. But the Wisdom aspect of the Goddess is really a Hellenized Jewish girl (like me!) and her Hebrew name is Chokmah (Wisdom). I could get very esoteric at this point if I wanted to, but I have a feeling you don't want me to.

You can read about her in the book of Proverbs in the Bible--not the whole thing but the personifications of Wisdom. They are more than personifications--she is really present in those passages, and I should know! On *P Classic I would sometimes post them in a note to someone who was going through a crisis, and it would help to calm them down and clarify things for them. I know because they told me so afterwards, even though I didn't tell them what I was doing and wasn't consciously aware of it myself at the time. They were the passages from the canonical scriptures (Proverbs) and not from the apocrypha or esoteric books.

quote:

I do get the impression that Dan Brown's perspectives and yours may not be quite the same.

I don't know why not. Considering the cultural and religious environment Jesus came from, it's a lot more reasonable to assume he was married (to Mary Magdalene) than that he wasn't. The Nag Hammadi scriptures say so explicitly; they say "the consort of Christ is Mary Magdalene."

I'm pretty sure some Gnostic groups believed Mary Magdalene was the incarnation of Sophia, as Jesus is said to be the incarnation of the Logos. Considering the hash the official Christian Church has made of the whole "incarnation" idea I'm a little leery of it except on the esoteric or symbolic level. Also considering my own religious background, there is a definite conflict of interest when it comes to worshipping ANY human being as God.

In any case I accept the idea that the earthly Mary Magdalene relocated to the south of France with her children after the crucifixion, which was probably faked as Bluelamp says. There is a longstanding tradition in India that Jesus spent many years there as a spiritual teacher and finally passed away at a ripe old age. There is even a tomb said to be his final resting place. The tradition of Mary Magdalene's presence in the south of France is also a very old one, and the Albigensian movement (a medieval Gnostic revival) was also centered in the south of France. I don't think that's a coincidence.

--Linda