Updating this topic in honor of the liberation of Tripoli and Libya - August 21, 2011. Here is where you can watch history being made:

Al Jazeera English Livestream

There are plenty of blank areas in this topic since I haven't been keeping up. Some of these blanks were unavoidable due to my recent move and other distractions. But for various reasons, I believe the time has come to revive this topic. There's a lot going on now.

--Linda

Linda,
     I am impressed by your link to Al Jazeera English Livestream. Have you read the article "NATO nations set to reap spoils of Libya war", listed in the sidebar on the right side of the page?
Seán

Sean,

I'll read the article tomorrow. I'm sick of arguing with people on the News board and probably won't be spending much time there from now on. Meanwhile I found this amazing article on Truthout that is directly relevant to the political situation and also to the topic of this thread. I hope you'll read it.

Three Things That Must Happen for Us to Rise Up and Defeat the Corporatocracy

Friday 26 August 2011
by: Bruce E. Levine, Alternet | Op-Ed

Most Americans oppose rule by the corporatocracy but don't have the tools to fight back. Here are three things we need to create a real people's movement.

Transforming the United States into something closer to a democracy requires: 1) knowledge of how we are getting screwed; 2) pragmatic tactics, strategies, and solutions; and 3) the “energy to do battle.”

<snip>

Right now what I'm most lacking is No. 3, the energy to do battle, or continue to do battle. That needs immediate attention. I not only need to replenish it, but also to know how to replenish it. One thing I do know is to first of all STOP depleting it in stupid pointless arguments.

--Linda

quote:

The majority of Americans oppose the corporatocracy (rule by giant corporations, the extremely wealthy elite,...—B. Levine

Linda,
     That may be true, but it would be impossible to maintain our current way of life without complex and powerful corporate structures. Reversion to the agrarian style of living is not an option because our population is too large. Perhaps our best hope is educate the people to the point where they can form corporations that serve the public's interest. At this time constructive action by the public is virtually impossible because all energy is consumed by partisan bickering. I wonder if that acrimony is deliberately induced by the elite to maintain the status quo?
Seán

     The USA is a bit beyond its 200th birthday and our warring partisans fight fiercely while their country falls apart. If it takes two centuries for such animosities to develop, that may explain Alexander Tytler's postulated lifespan for democracies.
Seán

quote:

That may be true, but it would be impossible to maintain our current way of life without complex and powerful corporate structures.

Sean,

Maybe I shouldn't have chosen this moment to answer your post, but OTOH maybe I couldn't even try to answer it unless I was totally fed up with EVERYTHING.

The corporations are too damn big and too powerful. As I just finished saying on the News board, it has reached the point where the upper 1% is an existential threat to the other 99%. And they want to keep it that way to keep us in line--they want us to know we're at their mercy. They need to have a good chunk of their wealth and power taken away from them, and returned to the people to whom it rightfully belongs by any means necessary.

NO, I do not mean armed revolution. Not that I'd even be against THAT if I thought it would work, but I know good and damned well "they" would love nothing better than an excuse to wipe out as many of us nebbishes as possible. Hey, at least you know what that word means now!

Have you been following the occupation of Wall Street? That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. There is also going to be a major demonstration in Washington D.C. that promises to be HUGE, and my daughter is going to be there along with many others. If it's effective at all it's likely to turn violent, and that is NEVER the fault of the demonstrators. It's never the choice of the demonstrators either.

The reason the revolution in Egypt succeeded (as much as it did succeed) without significant violence while in Libya it required an actual armed revolution had nothing to do with the behavior of the demonstrators. Both revolutions started out as massive nonviolent demonstrations. The determining factor was the response of the ruling authorities. Mubarak couldn't get his troops to fire on his own people. Gaddafi OTOH had foreign mercenaries positioned on the rooftops shooting at unarmed demonstrators. Sure, I suppose they could have given up, but if they had there would have been a bloodbath--and they knew it. They had lived under the guy's iron fist for 40+ years and they knew what kind of revenge he was capable of.

I hope you realize I'm not mad at you--just letting off steam here. I've spent the last few hours watching this Troy Davis abomination in Georgia--a condemned man who is most likely innocent strapped to a gurney, and then granted a last-minute reprieve by the Supreme Court within 15 minutes of his scheduled execution? And this is the FOURTH time it's happened in the last few years too. If that isn't torture I don't know what is!

UPDATE: Troy Davis was executed sometime within the last half hour or so. It's now 8:31 p.m. PDT as I'm typing this. I watched a few minutes of the live reporting of the abomination (after it was over) on Democracy Now! and that's all I could stand of it. According to the reporter, his last words were to the parents of the victim. He said he did not kill their son.

--Linda

Cross-posted on the News forum.

Stop the Machine! Create a New World!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A Call to Action - Oct. 6, 2011 and onward

October 2011 is the 10th anniversary of the invasion of Afghanistan and the beginning of the 2012 federal austerity budget. It is time to light the spark that sets off a true democratic, nonviolent transition to a world in which people are freed to create just and sustainable solutions.

We call on people of conscience and courage—all who seek peace, economic justice, human rights and a healthy environment—to join together in Washington, D.C., beginning on Oct. 6, 2011, in nonviolent resistance similar to the Arab Spring and the Midwest awakening.

A concert, rally and protest will kick off a powerful and sustained nonviolent resistance to the corporate criminals that dominate our government.

Forty-seven years ago, Mario Savio, an activist student at Berkeley, said, "There's a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious—makes you so sick at heart—that you can't take part. You can't even passively take part. And you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop. And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you're free, the machine will be prevented from working at all."

<snip>

http://october2011.org/

Linda,
     There is revolutionist's manifesto that pretends to be a comic strip on Yahoo. It is called Minimum Security and it views corporations very much as you do. To really get its message one should start with older episodes and work forward to the present; doing that is worth the effort.
     I am sympathetic with the sentiments expressed, but it disturbs me to see it has no vision beyond destroying the enemy—no thought is given to what happens after victory. Winning the war definitely will not make everything all right: We must have plans for a restoration capable of allowing the freedom we desire.
Seán

Originally posted by Sean:

quote:

Linda,
There is revolutionist's manifesto that pretends to be a comic strip on Yahoo. It is called Minimum Security and it views corporations very much as you do. To really get its message one should start with older episodes and work forward to the present; doing that is worth the effort.

Sean,

Thanks for the link to "Minimum Security." I began reading it from the beginning of the comic strip and I'm up to mid-August now. I forgot just how much I love counterculture comics, which are something of a tradition at this point. It started in the mid-1960s with R. Crumb and "Fritz the Cat." Remember that one? Maybe not...it's possible that was just a bit TOO counterculture for your taste! I barely remember it myself, but I understand R. Crumb has said in some recent interviews that he has always been a Gnostic.

Fortunately, there are blogs that specialize in pop culture and take it very seriously--as they SHOULD! I have been meaning to post a topic or two from one of my favorites here on the R&S board for months. They can refresh my memory on any of the old comic strips and 'zines (that's what my kids call 'em) that I may have forgotten about. In fact, I'm sure there are print reproductions of some of these counterculture classics available on Amazon and elsewhere.

About "Minimum Security," though: I'm up to August 24th now. I've read up to the part where Xavier has finally earned a few bucks delivering "office supplies" for shady Otto at the gun shop. He's gone to visit his out-of-town friend (who appears to be a groundhog or something), who is giving him advice about how to start and grow a grassroots movement. I'm having some trouble isolating the individual frames of the slideshow, or I'd post the link here.

--Linda

This story includes a short video of the ongoing Wall Street demonstration
Seán

quote:

Originally posted by Raksha:
I apologize, Linda—
     I erased your post and can't recover it,
Seán

Well, damn! It was a good post too--all about counterculture comics and stuff. Please try to be more careful from now on and stop erasing my words of wit and wisdom.

Linda,
     I know it was a good post because I read it. My early-morning fog had not yet lifted, which explains why I clicked the Edit instead of the Reply button. If you could send me a replacement for your post by e-mail, I could paste it where my apology appears. I truly hope you will be able to do that so I can conceal the evidence proving me a dolt.
Wishfully,
Seán

quote:

Originally posted by Sean:
Linda,
     I know it was a good post because I read it. My early-morning fog had not yet lifted, which explains why I clicked the Edit instead of the Reply button. If you could send me a replacement for your post by e-mail, I could paste it where my apology appears. I truly hope you will be able to do that so I can conceal the evidence proving me a dolt.
Wishfully,
Seán

Sean,

I probably could come up with a reasonable facsimile of that post if I wanted to take the time, but I'm not sure when I'll be able to get to it. I ended up spending most of the time on Blogger (where I just saw your "mea culpa" drawing and commented on it). It start off with a long comment on Rabbi Rami's blog--you know, same guy who came up with my sig line.

And THEN I came up with the totally brilliant idea of turning it into a new blog post, which is something I should do whenever I'm overcome with the need to hijack somebody else's blog. So I added a couple of paragraphs of explanation, found an image of a Semitic goddess that appealed to me, and added another paragraph of explanation at the end.

To get triple mileage out of it, I'm also going to post it here as a new note. Meanwhile you can read it here:

Random Thoughts on Judaism, Paganism and Genocide

--Linda

This one?

quote:

quote:

Originally posted by Sean:
Linda,
There is revolutionist's manifesto that pretends to be a comic strip on Yahoo. It is called Minimum Security and it views corporations very much as you do. To really get its message one should start with older episodes and work forward to the present; doing that is worth the effort.

Sean,

Thanks for the link to "Minimum Security." I began reading it from the beginning of the comic strip and I'm up to mid-August now. I forgot just how much I love counterculture comics, which are something of a tradition at this point. It started in the mid-1960s with R. Crumb and "Fritz the Cat." Remember that one? Maybe not...it's possible that was just a bit TOO counterculture for your taste! I barely remember it myself, but I understand R. Crumb has said in some recent interviews that he has always been a Gnostic.

Fortunately, there are blogs that specialize in pop culture and take it very seriously--as they SHOULD! I have been meaning to post a topic or two from one of my favorites here on the R&S board for months. They can refresh my memory on any of the old comic strips and 'zines (that's what my kids call 'em) that I may have forgotten about. In fact, I'm sure there are print reproductions of some of these counterculture classics available on Amazon and elsewhere.

About "Minimum Security," though: I'm up to August 24th now. I've read up to the part where Xavier has finally earned a few bucks delivering "office supplies" for shady Otto at the gun shop. He's gone to visit his out-of-town friend (who appears to be a groundhog or something), who is giving him advice about how to start and grow a grassroots movement. I'm having some trouble isolating the individual frames of the slideshow, or I'd post the link here.

--Linda

Thanks, Henry—
     That is the one.
Linda,
     Shall I plug it where you posted it?
Seán

Thanks, Henry! How the hell did you do that?

Sure, go ahead and plug it back in where it was, Sean. But be sure you don't lose it again in the process.

quote:

But be sure you don't lose it again in the process.

Done! If you were more like Henry, Linda, these things wouldn't happen.
Seán

     Returning to business. In several blogs dealing with the objectives of protests I've spoken of the need for specific plans and goals. My comments have been ignored, but similar remarks by others typically are hooted down. After some reflection I've concluded that is how it ought to be; plans are not essential. Demonstrations are effective if they create an opportunity for reformers, who are planners, to step in and change things for the better. Now I'm wondering how to ensure the reformers will be chosen from the good guys.
Seán

quote:

Thanks, Henry! How the hell did you do that?

I download for reading offline. Sometimes the file is still around.

Henry

quote:

Returning to business. In several blogs dealing with the objectives of protests I've spoken of the need for specific plans and goals. My comments have been ignored...

Sean,

Most protests have an underlying set of specific plans and goals that might have been years in the making. Do you recall that a few months back I took an online seminar called "How To Redesign the World"? I posted about it on this thread, but I haven't gone back over my earlier notes or to the seminar website to refresh my memory. It was all about building a lifestyle and an economy based upon sustainability rather than growth, and there are specific techniques and strategies involved.

If I seem to ignore your comments asking for specific plans and goals, it's because the subject is too open-ended and would require a dissertation to answer adequately. So often I say nothing at all. Also, I have discovered recently (not referring to you here) that the demand for specific plans and goals is really a not-so-subtle attempt to discredit and sabotage the beginning of a movement. As Glenn Greenwald put it, addressing the latest attempts to trash the Wall Street protests:

quote:

Most importantly, very few protest movements enjoy perfect clarity about tactics or command widespread support when they begin; they're designed to spark conversation, raise awareness, attract others to the cause, and build those structural planks as they grow and develop. Dismissing these incipient protests because they lack fully developed, sophisticated professionalization is akin to pronouncing a three-year-old child worthless because he can't read Schopenhauer: those who are actually interested in helping it develop will work toward improving those deficiencies, not harp on them in order to belittle its worth.

I'm going to get some sleep now and address the rest of your post sometime tomorrow, although I can't tell you exactly when.

--Linda

quote:

... very few protest movements enjoy perfect clarity about tactics or command widespread support when they begin; they're designed to spark conversation, raise awareness, attract others to the cause, and build those structural planks as they grow and develop. ...those who are actually interested in helping it develop will work toward improving those deficiencies.—Greenwald

Linda,
     I think G. is saying much the same thing I have, except I've added that the demonstrators do not want or need to know the strategies. Structural details can and should be added by the leaders who emerge once the cause is won. My hope is the chosen leaders will support the purpose of the movement; that has not been evident in the Arab Spring.
Seán

To continue:
     Passive resistance is a proven strategy. I have no doubt a multitude of peaceful demonstrators can bring the Establishment to a grinding halt without quite knowing how or why it happens. The effect is comparable to pouring sand into a gear-box: All wheels stop turning until repairs are made.
     Since our survival, including that of demonstrators, depends upon the existence of a complex socio-economic structure, the planners of our revolution should be devising ways and means for replacing those now operating. As example: When much-despised Monsanto is dismantled, who will provide the seed and fertilizer it supplies? Will the new entity be prepared to fill the gap before half the world has starved to death? Answers to such questions must be available for a successful revolution and there is no reason why they can't be made public in advance. I can understand why leadership, for safety's sake, is secret, although such reticence seems cowardly. A true leader should be prepared for martyrdom.
Seán

quote:

Since our survival, including that of demonstrators, depends upon the existence of a complex socio-economic structure, the planners of our revolution should be devising ways and means for replacing those now operating. As example: When much-despised Monsanto is dismantled, who will provide the seed and fertilizer it supplies? Will the new entity be prepared to fill the gap before half the world has starved to death? Answers to such questions must be available for a successful revolution and there is no reason why they can't be made public in advance.

Sean,

Good grief, NONE of that kind of thing is a secret or ever has been! It's all been very public knowledge for years, although you won't find it in anybody's manifesto. Where you will find it are in the hundreds of books written on sustainable agriculture, urban homesteading, seed saving, herbalism, alternative medicine and dozens of other related topics, and on the websites of the authors of these books.

In other words, you won't find it in ONE single centralized location, and the odds are that you won't find it in overtly political locations either. Now global food security is VERY MUCH a political issue (nothing like a good old-fashioned bread riot to start a revolution in record time), and so the people involved in food security issues tend to have a high political awareness. But when they are involved in explaining composting techniques (for example), their politics are necessarily on the back burner. But only temporarily. These same people may very well be political activists as well--they just don't do both at the same time!

My daughter and her Reclaiming community are prime examples of the worldview I'm trying to convey here, but there are many others. I really wish you'd read The Fifth Sacred Thing for a description or evocation of the world and lifestyle of the not-too-distant future. It would answer a lot of the questions you've been asking me. These are not absolute, dogmatic answers and were never intended to be. Of course the picture it presents is only one of many possible futures, but to my mind that future becomes more possible by the day. Writing in 1996, the biggest error Starhawk made was in her projection of the date of the Revolution for around 2020. It's actually happening right now, so she overshot it by about eight years.

Although I talked a lot about The Fifth Sacred Thing in earlier parts of this topic, I hesitated to explicitly recommend it because I didn't know how you'd deal with the anything-goes sexual relationships among the characters. These are presented as quite mainstream and normal, although they typically involve three or more people in a complex of same-sex and opposite-sex relationships, even for primarily heterosexual characters. Some of it is a bit over the top even for me, and I came of age in the Sixties! You are older than me, and while I don't think of you as prudish exactly I thought maybe I should give you a heads-up before you order it (if you do).

The resulting familial relationships can get pretty confusing by the time it gets down to the third generation. I had to read the relevant flashback scenes THREE times before I finally figured out how the two younger characters, Bird and Madrone, are related to the clan matriarch Maya (age 98 in the story), her longtime partner Rio and her best friend Johanna. Ordinary monogamous geneaology is confusing enough for me, but when you get into this polyamorous stuff it gets pretty tangled in a hurry!

--Linda

Linda,
     After reading this excerpt from The Fifth Sacred Thing, I see no reason to buy the book. The lifestyle it pictures is delightful, but restricted to a colony. It offers little help for a country-full of people suddenly confronted with the fruits of revolution. Lest you think my sexual preferences— which are quintessentially conventional— put me off the book, I must assure you I am not disturbed by the free-style sexuality you mention. However, I am really troubled by the inattention to the practicalities essential to the survival of society at large. We can't simply plan a future for a selected few and let everyone else go begging. That would create a culture I would refuse to live in.
     I chose Monsanto only as an exemplar; food is not the only problem. Verily, almost every aspect of our lives depends upon goods and services provided by large corporations. As far as I can see, the best hope for rectifying matters is to infiltrate those corporations with good and honest people who will extirpate the evil while retaining what is good. I think the hard part would be to find people willing to be trained to manage major enterprises. Once qualified, corporations will employ them in a heartbeat; right now they are forced to pay huge salaries to officials who, at best, are mediocre.
    The protest is spreading!
Seán